dinuriel
Full Member
Torturing characters? Me? Nooo...
Posts: 374
|
Post by dinuriel on Mar 10, 2011 21:57:21 GMT -5
Okay, so I'm in this creative writing class right now, and so far, we've had two assignments, the second of which we got back today. All of the assignments are marked on a four point scale. The first assignment, I handed in something that I thought was kind of shaky, but ended up getting a four. The one we got back today... well, in my opinion, it was much better. It had more of a plot and the interactions between the characters were more varied and the overall flow had improved. But I only got a three. Why? Because A) It "felt like a part of a larger piece and not a full short story" and B) it was "genre fiction". I could rant about Point A for hours. I don't like writing short stories, and honestly, I don't really like reading them either. To me, they are part of a larger piece, and that's that. I know some people feel differently, but that's how I feel, and personally I find it tough to write five pages double-spaced without implying that something happened before and something else will happen after. But Point B? That kind of pissed me off. What pissed me off even more is the comment the TA wrote. He's a good TA, and he knows me because I'm annoying and constantly in his face, and he knows I want to get into the BFA program. I'm not really pissed off at him, just at what he seems to be implying: "When you prepare your application package for the BFA program, you're going to want to submit literary samples." So... I'm getting into this program based on how well I cater to what the selection committee wants, not on how well I actually write what I want to write? Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against literary fiction--I've read great literary fiction, and I have some literary elements in my own genre fiction--but do I want to write a strictly literary piece? At this point in my life, no, I don't. My current ideas are for genre fiction, and I don't see why I should have to deviate from that. Since when has genre fiction been a joke? It's not all Dan Brown and Stephenie Meyer. There's some quality genre stuff out there, and if the selection committee doesn't want to acknowledge that, then I don't know if I'm in the right place. I write what I want to write. Suck it, department
|
|
|
Post by sb on Mar 10, 2011 22:08:02 GMT -5
Couldn't anything be genre fiction? I mean, it's possible to categorize any writing unless it's so totally weird it's incomprehensible. That's stupid.
You are probably over analyzing what your TA said. If you know him and he's usually reasonable, he probably didn't mean it as a veiled insult.
|
|
|
Post by celebkiriedhel on Mar 10, 2011 22:15:20 GMT -5
Personally - I'd get your TA to explain what he means by point (B). It's easy to misunderstand what people are saying sometimes, and it's better to clarify it, than to create an obstacle for your later educational career. But as for preparing things that suit the selection committee - how is that different from any other learning course? We don't do exams or apply to enter courses except to show committees/teachers/the powers that be that we can give them what they want. They're not looking for originality. That comes later after you've learnt everything from them that you can, and you've freed yourself from the requirements of being assessed. Kiri
|
|
|
Post by thelunarfox on Mar 10, 2011 22:15:25 GMT -5
What Beth said. Anything can be classified as genre fiction I think if you really give it a try. If anything, this sort of shows the frustrating subjective nature of art. This is also why I didn't go to school for writing. I don't like people judging it based on some scale I don't feel a part of. There's nothing wrong with genre fiction. But school sort of is all about pleasing someone else just like any other job. XP Edit: And Kiri sneaks in and puts it into words so much better, lol.
|
|
|
Post by Velvet on Mar 12, 2011 19:43:02 GMT -5
My first response after reading your post dinuriel was "you go girl!" :giggle:
I don't find anything wrong with genre fiction; it's a genre because a group of people happen to like a type of story. What's wrong with that? Nothing! But, when you're in a school setting you sometimes have to play along to get along. It sucks and isn't a good use of time in my opinion but it is what it is. Hopefully the class will be worth it in the end.
|
|
dinuriel
Full Member
Torturing characters? Me? Nooo...
Posts: 374
|
Post by dinuriel on Mar 12, 2011 19:48:25 GMT -5
Thanks all.
What I've decided to do for now is look through my endless archive of genre fiction for sections that seem a little more literary. I just hope the courses--if I do get in, which seems increasingly unlikely every time I think about it--will be worth it and will allow me a little more freedom in what I can submit for grading.
|
|
|
Post by Velvet on Mar 12, 2011 19:53:41 GMT -5
Here's hoping for the best!
|
|
|
Post by mdpthatsme on Mar 12, 2011 20:25:32 GMT -5
Confused. Genre means selection, type, etc; therefore genre fiction means a selection of fiction... I don't like literary fiction in general. I don't write it. I don't read it. It's just not my cup of tea. dinuriel: I understand your position on short stories because I cannot write a short story if my life depended on it. There's always more to tell about a past and what may happen in the future. This makes me remember that I need to learn how to condense. I also understand why you are upset at the committee. How in the hell do you find great writers if you don't let them write what they love to write? Of course a person such as me who writes fantasy cannot write the same fabulous quality with realistic fiction. It's just not in me. I wonder about college programs...you pay for them, but you don't get what you want out of them and you cannot choose what you want to write. It's grr face time. Well...meh will have to do.
|
|
dinuriel
Full Member
Torturing characters? Me? Nooo...
Posts: 374
|
Post by dinuriel on Mar 13, 2011 0:07:36 GMT -5
It seems almost elitist in a way. Unfortunately, genre fiction seems to have gotten a bad rep among certain academic circles do to some best-selling genre novels that weren't really all that well-written (I think we can all name a few). I've read some literary fiction that I've loved, and some literary fiction that I haven't--and some genre fiction that I've loved, and some genre fiction that I haven't. I do think elements of literary fiction can be incorporated in genre fiction rather nicely. But yeah, writers should write what they want to write, and what they feel comfortable writing (I don't feel comfortable doing straight-up literary--I can put literary elements into genre fiction, but dammit I need my imaginary setting and made-up words). If I wanted to apply to art school with water colors, I doubt anyone would be telling me to do oil paintings.
|
|
|
Post by rad on Mar 13, 2011 7:39:03 GMT -5
There was a great programme on BBC Two about this last week, Sue Perkins went and met authors and readers of 'genre fiction' - particularly crime, thriller and chick lit, I seem to remember. It was interesting to see how the fiction world does tend to polarise those books from the 'literary' stuff (which is what I mostly read myself) and Perkins was arguing that often the 'genre' stuff is better on plot, whilst the literary stuff is better in terms of writing, and that really they should share techniques more - that there's nothing wrong with plotty fiction that is also well-written and vice-versa.
|
|
|
Post by thelunarfox on Mar 13, 2011 10:48:44 GMT -5
That program sounds interesting! I love the end conclusion.
Is it just me, or does it seem like the literature world likes to keep things nice and competitive? Self pub vs. traditional pub. Genre fiction vs. literature. Art vs. commercial success. And I guess in a way it makes sense considering the whole industry. There are only a limited number of slots. It is rather stifling creatively, but there are lessons to learn from it.
|
|
|
Post by hrootbeer on Mar 13, 2011 13:29:48 GMT -5
I like both styles of fiction to read. For writing, I'd write genre. I don't know why the academic world is so "poo poo" about genre work. Frankly, genre fiction is where the money is. Maybe they're afraid of being "sell outs" which I think is pure BS. If your writing is good, who cares what style it is? Me personally, I appreciate the writers in "genre" fiction who actually apply craft in their writing rather than just moving us through a good romp of a book.
I'm going to mention Stephanie Meyers (no hating). Say what you will about the Twilight series, but her writing is very well done. She makes rookie errors in the first book, but her writing gets better as she goes. I think she could have written a literary book, but she choose to write in genre. I feel the same way about J.K. Rowling, though I don't believe Harry Potter is as literary as Twilight. My point in using these to highly commercial authors is that both cared about the craft of the writing and paid attention to it while writing their genre works.
I do think you should go back to the TA and ask about craft and not content. Would he have given a 4 if it had been the same craftsmanship but a different subject. If so, then I think you need to contest the grade. BTW, I can't remember college that well, but can't you go to the professor to contest a grade a TA gives if you don't agree with it?
|
|
|
Post by laura on Mar 13, 2011 13:38:43 GMT -5
Van, I'm sorry your TA is giving you a hard time. And I bet some of the other professors wouldn't agree with his methods. It's definitely not okay, IMO, and my program wasn't like that. I remember a girl in my workshops back in uni who wrote beautiful fantasy stuff, and nobody thought twice about it. I say write what you want to write, and write it the best that you can!
|
|
dinuriel
Full Member
Torturing characters? Me? Nooo...
Posts: 374
|
Post by dinuriel on Mar 13, 2011 15:20:41 GMT -5
The whole industry does seem kind of polar in some ways, doesn't it? Maybe it's just the human tendency to put stuff in labeled boxes.
Thanks for the support, everyone. I'm not sure if I'm going to contest the grade or not, because I do have quite a bit on my plate right now and I can live with the a 3. I'm more worried about the application at this point.
And I do think that genre and literary fiction can be combined well, and that there is some beautiful genre stuff out there. I guess worse comes to worse, I could always transfer to another university (although that does mean I'd have to move).
|
|
|
Post by rad on Mar 13, 2011 18:31:36 GMT -5
The best thing to do is chat to your TA, not defensively, just genuinely seeking his advice and feedback. And remember any course is going to need you to jump through certain hoops to prove you can do X, Y and Z - that needn't limit your creativity in general, but just means you have to prove you can work in the ways required as well as in ways that play more to your strengths.
|
|