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Post by laura on Dec 23, 2010 10:07:25 GMT -5
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Post by laura on Dec 24, 2010 19:10:06 GMT -5
I went through a hell of a lot of trouble to get one of my shots this afternoon, lol! I needed access to Matt's inventory, but I also needed a town street shot. Now it dawns on me that I could have just had him just buy some community lot in town for a minute, but honestly, this set only took me about half an hour. It would have taken me 15 minutes just to send him somewhere in load time, and I'll only need this spot just this once. So I whipped up a fake street front in the yard, lol! Ah well. This is a bit of a flashback shot too. So I grabbed a couple of "actors" to play the parts of this scene that took place about 12 years ago Liza says, "Oh my God, I can't believe you put me in a skirt." Robbie doesn't mind. Under the spoiler, because it's actually the first shot of my next story piece. Final shot then. Is it worth all the trouble, maybe, probably not... Bonus points to anyone who can guess what this shot is from And Robbie says, "Hey Lizzy, you kind of have nice legs."
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Post by sb on Dec 24, 2010 19:14:31 GMT -5
Those shots are beautiful! What a wonderful, creative solution! adore the pumpkins...
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Post by raquelaroden on Dec 24, 2010 19:26:24 GMT -5
I know what that shot is from! It's from Matt and Leila's first meeting, isn't it? Awesome picture! I can't wait for this update.
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Post by laura on Dec 24, 2010 19:39:17 GMT -5
Thanks guys! Oh, thought I'd also mention that I just exited without saving when I was finished so I wouldn't have to take everything back down, lol! Rachel, gold star! You're right
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Post by laura on Dec 30, 2010 16:04:19 GMT -5
Sometimes I feel very frustrated at my inability to reach 100% of my readers. Maybe someone tell me it's impossible so I'll stop worrying about it. It's distracting me from my other work. :\
(Kiri, I need a "meh" smiley, lol!)
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Post by Stacy on Dec 30, 2010 16:39:45 GMT -5
Sometimes I feel very frustrated at my inability to reach 100% of my readers. Maybe someone tell me it's impossible so I'll stop worrying about it. It's distracting me from my other work. :\ (Kiri, I need a "meh" smiley, lol!) *hugs* I know that feeling. Haven't found a cure for it myself. But screaming "They don't understand my art!" has a certain therapeutic value, lol. Also what Illandrya said.
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Post by thelunarfox on Dec 30, 2010 16:50:29 GMT -5
Exactly what Stacy and Illandrya said.
I think you sort of have to let go once it's out there. Perhaps you had intended it to be one way, but if it's a good piece of work then it should be possible to be read multiple ways that you might not have intended. Of course there are also the times when someone completely misunderstands, but like Illandrya said, it's based on their own experiences and perceptions.
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Post by Stacy on Dec 30, 2010 17:32:50 GMT -5
I've been thinking about this on the way home from work and wanted to say more.
Someone once told me they tried to read my stuff but didn't make it all the way through because they didn't like the horror elements. They were very friendly and cordial about it and said that I shouldn't think my stuff sucked. It was just a personal taste issue.
And also - I thought about sharing this part and I don't know if I should do it but I'm going to.
I wonder if maybe I don't get your stuff the way you mean it. If so, it's because I am weird and didn't have a lot of experiences that you guys seem to have had and I don't think about relationships in the same way that you guys do. And honestly I've had to take a break from reading a lot of people's stories because of all the sex around lately, lol. Which again - that has nothing to do with the stories themselves or the writers. It's all my own experiences and issues and perceptions, like everyone's said.
It doesn't mean at all that you're not a good writer or that your stuff isn't great, because it is. It just means that as much as we want objectivity, as much as we fight for it, it's impossible. Even though I do think people are capable of objective aesthetic perception, it's on an individual basis and it's fairly rare. I don't think that we should stop aiming for universal constant objectivity though, and I totally understand angsting about it, and I guess I just wanted to say that I hear you and maybe get what you're saying.
*hugs* again
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Post by laura on Dec 30, 2010 19:40:58 GMT -5
Illandrya, thanks, lol! I just wanted to hear from someone else that it's actually impossible. It is driving me a little mad. But yes, it's the experiences and personal values I keep running into problems with I think, especially with the kinds of stories I write. It's fine, and I DO get that everybody comes to these stories from a completely different perspective. Hell, I think I've shown that even within my own stories, two people come at a situation with completely different values and world views. So I *get* that, but I still don't know how to react to it. What do I say? What is the appropriate response? I feel like I keep getting defensive in order to explain things. I feel like Leila trying to explain her whole world view to Matt, and he just can't see it, lol! Lunar, yes, but how!? How do you let go!? It's like one of my babies, lol! If I write a story with a certain intention in mind, but a reader comes at the story wanting to find something different there, something that it's not, and will never be, what do I do? Stacy, lol! Yes, yelling that totally does help a little! I think you and I see our work a lot the same way. We make ART with capital letters, lol! We have big ideas in mind, and we want them to be understood. Maybe we bring this on ourselves then, lol! ;D No matter what story I write, I suppose there's going to be somebody pissed off over it. I just happen to write about the kinds of things that incite passionate reactions in people. So I need to learn to deal with that. And I'm trying. No matter what book you look up on Amazon, even the ones unanimously agreed to be *great*, there's going to be at least one person who slammed it and gave it 1-star. It's the nature of putting your work out into the public. It's not everybody's cup of tea. Fair enough. Thanks for the hugs!
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Post by celebkiriedhel on Dec 30, 2010 20:52:44 GMT -5
meh smiley will be top of my list when I get back to Melbourne.
I don't think you should even try to explain. Let them not understand it, and hope that it makes sense later on. Sometimes when you get defensive trying to explain, it can make it worse because they move further in. Also - you're always going to know more about what's going on because you are in your character's head, while we (the readers) can only see it from the outside.
Also, I think that sometimes we get where you are coming from - we just want a different outcome based on our experiences and values. But in the end, it's your story and your outcome. You need to stick with the original, and not let yourself feel pressured to change/explain it. Because no matter how you explain it, they/we will still want the different outcome.
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Post by Stacy on Dec 30, 2010 21:15:21 GMT -5
By objective I meant coming to the story free and open and not imposing your will or worldview on it. Like what Kiri said about readers wanting certain outcomes- that's the reader imposing their will.
I get Salinger now.
Basically - Laura, you're awesome and you should do what you want and write what you feel and screw the people who don't get it or try to force you into their mental boxes.
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Post by laura on Dec 30, 2010 21:17:11 GMT -5
Illandrya, yes, walking away is a very good method! I often find myself having to do that, lol! Or I'll write out my vent version of the reply, and leave it sit there for an hour or so, then come back and write the sane version That's a very good point, that if everyone 100% got what I was writing, it would probably mean that it was very bland. Never thought of it that way. Kiri, yay, thanks in advance for the smiley! Yes, I know, the defensiveness and explaining does make it worse, and I end up giving away most of my story when I do it too, lol! I need to come up with some stock responses for these kinds of things.
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Post by laura on Dec 30, 2010 21:21:49 GMT -5
Stacy, yes, that's really the part I have the hardest time with, the mental boxes, and the readers wanting very specific outcomes based on a narrow world view. Drives me batty, lol! I guess the thing of it is, when I come to a story, I want the author to tell me a story. If I wanted a very particular story that ended up just how I wanted it, I would write it myself, lol! Okay, I think we got this hammered out now!
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Post by thelunarfox on Dec 30, 2010 21:29:06 GMT -5
I wish I could tell you how to not be defensive about it, lol. Honestly, I feel that way too sometimes. And then I feel like such a failure because if I were a better writer, it would have been clear. But if people are reading and invested enough to want a particular outcome, isn't that a good thing? I know it's still not exactly the same, but it's something.
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Post by raquelaroden on Dec 30, 2010 21:29:36 GMT -5
I think that the fact that you have characters who are complex enough to be misunderstood is actually a very good thing. I mean...I really don't think it's anything to do with your writing--it's that you've made a character so real that just like in real life, sometimes their motives and explanations are misinterpreted or only half understood. I think confusion about Matt and Leila is...well, to be expected--it's such a tricky situation, and I think a lot of people (myself included, surely) are always looking for the "bad" guy--the one who is at fault, to blame, etc.. The problem is that you've created such a realistic and complex story for them that it's difficult to see who is to blame, or exactly where they made their wrong turns--it's really difficult to say, "And *that* is where they went wrong so now we have an explanation", and that can drive readers crazy, but in a wonderful way. You don't give us easy solutions or situations, and in that way you reflect the dizzying complexities of real life. That's amazing!
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Post by Stacy on Dec 31, 2010 1:45:52 GMT -5
I went and read all the comments on your latest update. You know - it was a frequent commenter of mine who killed Gunky. She never got it, and her suggestions for the story went against everything I wanted and the characters and the situation. It was like she was taking control of the story rather than playing along. And so it died. She must have found something in my work though, because she kept reading and commenting. It's like you say in your responses to the comments - some people are just fundamentally different and things won't work between them, even if they care about each other. Even if they see something in your work and you appreciate their reading it and their comments. And it may be best to cut your losses, thank them for their comment, and go on with the story you want to tell without regard to what they think. It's totally not a failure in the storytelling. It's not. It's just - you know, maybe you're a bird and they're a fish.
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lepifera
Junior Member
"....."
Posts: 93
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Post by lepifera on Dec 31, 2010 3:36:29 GMT -5
Isn't it frustrating for a driver who is trying to have a conversation about how beautiful the landscape is on a journey, when the passengers are too busy arguing whether to turn left or right at the next intersection, or about whether they should have turned left or right five minutes ago? -from one of the many back seat drivers
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Post by laura on Dec 31, 2010 8:32:39 GMT -5
Lunar, yes, that's it! I also feel like I've failed when people don't get it. I'm glad to hear you guys feel these things too, because you all always seem so confident and collected, lol! Rachel, ha, I do do that, don't I? I make my own head spin sometimes with the complicated and impossible situations these characters get into, lol! But awww, thank you! Stacy, awww, I'm so sorry to hear that about Gunky You know, I totally get it though. And I've felt, not quite to that point of giving up, but so frustrated that I stew on it for three days and can't do anything else and wonder about what I'm doing and if I want to be doing it. But yes, I think you're right, a simple thank you and carry on. Because it's in the explaining and defense that I think I get even more worked up, so from now on maybe I'll try to skip that part. lepifera, lol, yes! Thank you! It is just like that! I appreciate that you understand.
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Post by sb on Dec 31, 2010 9:36:29 GMT -5
I hesitated to say anything about this whole issue since I have little to offer as a writer, but, coming at it as a reader, I think the people with the problems are in the wrong aisle. It's possible to begin reading wonderful, complex work like yours, get very involved, and then realize it is NOT the kind of book you thought you bought. Readers get very displeased when you don't give them what they want, even if they had no reason to expect you would. Unhappy Reader needs to put down the book and go ask directions to the aisle with the kind of novel she wanted to read.
You know you cannot possibly please everybody. Your writing is beautiful.
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