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Post by Stacy on Oct 27, 2009 20:50:21 GMT -5
This makes my skin crawl. This anon comment pretty much sums it all up for me. I do indeed have a day job. And maybe I should just keep writing Sims stories. I do art. I do themes. I do ideas. I do literature. Another comment. I care about the sound. I care about the poetry. I identify as a writer. There, I said it. My identity is all wrapped up in this here keyboard. And I want to make art, not sales. Is that a bad thing?
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Post by dbloveshermac on Oct 27, 2009 22:03:30 GMT -5
I read the agent's blog entry that you linked, and it left me thinking the following:
1. If he says he "can't sell" those literary artist books, then maybe it's a problem with his selling skills rather than with the author. 2. Part of the problem might be that we as a society let ourselves settle for less and become less. Today I don't care to make the effort to spell "definitely" correctly or create a multifaceted character, and tomorrow I won't even be bothered with punctuation or plot consistency. It's a downward spiral. 3. After having one's carefully crafted work (be it story or painting or quilt or whatever) treated no better than a fast food hamburger wrapper over and over and over, it is hard to fight cynicism, but… (see number 4) 4. Caring is good. Painful sometimes, but good and noble and life-giving.
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Post by thelunarfox on Oct 27, 2009 22:06:53 GMT -5
To be honest, I think you are treading way too close to making value judgments about those who have to write for a living.
I admire someone who attacks writing as a job. It isn't a magical craft where words flow smoothly out of no where when an angle whispers in your ear. You have to work at it building up the muscle. And like Carnaxa says, write even without inspiration until inspiration hits.
If you plan on making a living writing, you have to plan on writing and writing and writing. That doesn't make one's work any less and doesn't mean that they don't care. Great writing comes when one least expects it.
It seems more that the author of that article had a problem with writers who write about their writing rather than explicitly explaining their story. It's sort of our writers vs. story tellers discussion.
You can make a beautiful sounding piece that reads well and says nothing. That's nice, but what's the point of reading something about nothing? Even great literature has a plot, character development, events. And tying all those together are the words, themes, allusions, etc.
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Post by girlyesterday on Oct 27, 2009 22:26:44 GMT -5
I had a reply worked out but Lunar said it way better than I could.
It's not a bad thing to think of it as art, but if the aim is to make a living out of writing, then it is like any other 9-5 job. It's unfortunate but true, not to mention deadlines and editor's breathing down your neck wanting that promised MS AND readers waiting impatiently for volume 2 of that series (and why is the author taking so damn long to write it) - you get what I mean.
I've been waiting five long years for Isobelle Carmody to finish her Obernewtyn series.
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Post by Stacy on Oct 27, 2009 23:43:23 GMT -5
I kind of have this thing where no one ever taught me about tact but I taught myself how to go for the throat with words and I think I really took the class on persuasive essays to heart, so - err - my language tends to be strong.
And I think I just had an epiphany about my social problems in text-based environments, lol.
I wish I could write for a living, and certainly plenty of people do that and produce good work. They aren't posting on this blog, though.
The particular attitude I saw in that particular post and in most of the comments did make me feel icky and wrong. It's like they were basically saying that cranking out crap for money was the only way to write and - well, they certainly don't have the nicest of tones towards people who do consider writing art, paid or not. Like I said, plenty of people get paid for writing stuff that is really good.
And I guess I should really be reading their blogs instead, right?
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Post by thelunarfox on Oct 28, 2009 12:21:17 GMT -5
lol, yes you should. Find those people who speak to you.
That guy is in the business of selling. That in itself is an art, but it does leave you feeling a little icky. You kind of have to work on spin.
I didn't get the feeling he was judging anyone who writes to make art and has a passion for it. He was just begging those who submit stuff to him to realize what he needs to do, and that they have to work with him.
If you plan on getting anything in print, unfortunately that's something you'd have to deal with. They'll want to change your book the same way they pick out a demo tape and say, "But can it play on the radio?"
lol, also I wouldn't worry about being blunt. I've learned some tact, I hope, over the years, though uh, sometimes I worry. It's not natural for me.
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moondaisy
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Post by moondaisy on Nov 5, 2009 21:00:55 GMT -5
Des goȗts et des couleurs, on ne se dispute pas! The person you quoted, Stacy, would put my heckles up too! With that difference that I don't aspire to write 'art' and can recognize 'commercial trash' when I see it. My sole reason to write at all is to entertain people, maybe make them think about a few issues...
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Post by mdpthatsme on Nov 15, 2009 1:50:34 GMT -5
Stacy: I'm sure those people who write for a living have a blog site some where or are in psychiatric care. Because you either have a support/discussion group or end up in the loony bin. Ideas cannot be contained after all; therefore, you are either creative or crazy. I fall deeply in the second category. Writing can be art, compulsion, feeling, and very well be nothing if you wish it to be. As for me, writing is my voice, my passion, and my imagination trying to escape the fortress I have created to maintain it. Oh, let's scare the little people, well, all the people. If you want to publish, as do I, then we'll have to go through lots and lots of craP, yes with a capital P.
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moondaisy
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Post by moondaisy on Nov 23, 2009 19:50:37 GMT -5
I appreciate your passionate reply... It's nothing short of what I expected. One thing I wonder about, Stacy... is it the creative process or the fact your readers like what you do that spur you on? You are a genius in my opinon and it would not surprise me if the answer is the former rather than the latter. Still...
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Post by Luminessence on Dec 4, 2009 10:05:26 GMT -5
To be honest, the whole feud between literary writers and commercial writers bothers me in ways I'm not sure I know how to articulate. I'll do my best though. I don't tend to like stories that fall into the extremes of either category - I've read books that seem to have no soul, that look like they were written from a paint-by-numbers guide, and I usually put them down before I finish. I've also read books that sacrifice story for the sake of style and theme and creating Literature with a capital L, and I don't tend to finish those either. I want stories that entertain me, and I want them to have depth. The two things - entertainment and thought - do not need to be mutually exclusive, but for some reason a whole lot of people approach it that way. (There are three authors I can think of off the top of my head who prove the "the two are always mutually exclusive" idea wrong: Dean Koontz, who puts philosophical themes into his horror thrillers; Holly Lisle, who writes fantasy novels full of richness and depth and meaning; and Moriah Jovan, whose novel The Proviso uses romance-novel tropes unapologetically and yet is absolutely nothing like a paint-by-numbers romance novel.) I do write to publish (my Sims stories are how I let off creative steam), and the whole concept of "if you're a professional writer you need to approach writing like a fast-food job" really bothers me. Yes, if you're a published author, or writing with aspirations towards publication like I am, you have to have a different approach to it - you can't afford to wait for inspiration to strike. But that, in my mind, is completely different from treating your writing like a fast-food burger. (I'm pretty sure I've read things on Holly Lisle's website about this, although for the life of me I can't remember where... and part of me says it was in her writing course rather than on the website. She's a genre writer who writes for a living, and yet refuses to write stories that are the literary equivalent of fast food.) Sorry about the rant; I've just seen quotes like the ones in the original post, and quotes from the opposite extreme, way too many times
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